Northern Tracks Forum

General Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: Swamp Dawg on January 04, 2011, 10:25:54 pm

Title: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on January 04, 2011, 10:25:54 pm

Just went out to start our 1952 Narrow Bombardier and noticed there was a ticking noise in the Ford 300 engine that did not sound good. We thought it may have a lifter or a valve problem after sitting over the summer period. We noticed the noise seemed to go away so we ran it about a kilometer but noticed the power was poor.

After getting back to the shop we pulled the valve cover to inspect the valve train while running. The valves and rockers seemed fine so we pulled the plugs and noticed no. 1 cylinder had loose metal in it and the piston has been hammered up. The engine has only 100 plus hours since overhaul but has seen some heavy pulling in that time.
We will pull it and give it what is required as soon as possible.

While getting some advise from Bluetoque ,he mentioned that the Ford 300 is noted for failing the No 1 cylinder due to cooling issues from the water jacked design.
Any comments on this problem will be appreciated.

Paul-Ray

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: the old trucker on January 05, 2011, 07:02:09 am

   Dawg I'm sorry to hear about the motor. I guess it has put all the Ford guys on alert mode, myself included... Of course mine hasn't hauled a heavy load yet....untill I get into it...... :D ;D

                                                                                           OT.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Cranman on January 05, 2011, 08:08:56 am

Bad news. Just a long shot and I'm no 300 Ford man but I read that Ford dealt with the piston heat by directing an oil stream at the piston base from the top rod bearing. Have come across a couple instances where oil galleries weren't redrilled on rebuild so this may be something to look at on disassembly. Had a cooked end main ruined on a cat grader once at 50 hrs and I read about a Cessna 185 that flew 20 hours on the assembly grease before it seized the main. Hope it is not too serious you guys.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: kpm on January 05, 2011, 10:18:22 am

hmmm...the 300 is tough..I wonder if one of the water or oil  inlets had excess gasket glue or silicone blocking it from proper flow...have run bout six of theses engines and never no problems with no 1..
....the latter the vintage of 3oo you can find(eg)early 70's...the better the engine all around including HP.
                                                                                       kpm

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: kpm on January 05, 2011, 06:06:22 pm

...forgot to mention...check your carb adjustment....if you were pulling really heavy....and it was turned real lean....could result in no.1 coming apart...being as it is the lead piston...correct adjustment should be turn and a half out to turn and 3/4 depending on 1v or 2v carb
                                       
                                                                                            kpm

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on January 05, 2011, 10:05:48 pm

Hmm good info, we'll keep you updated.  Should have the engine out next week.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: kpm on January 08, 2011, 05:16:09 pm

.....question...when youse rebult your 300,did you use a straight grade oil,or multigrade the first(break in) trip??
           kpm

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: bluetoque on January 08, 2011, 08:36:07 pm

 I had Hackles Engine Shop here in PA overhaul a couple of engines for me and they said no Quaker State or Penzoil for break in oil and no excesive idling. KPM is right.Use the right oil on break in.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: kpm on January 09, 2011, 08:03:59 pm

...it is safest to use a straight grade oil upon break in of a rebuilt engine...eg..sae 30.....make sure it's a warm start!!!....and drain after first 20 miles or so...i've found 0-30 synthetic to work the best for the bombardiers,after break in oil has been removed.
                           kpm

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: shorty on January 11, 2011, 09:48:20 pm

Hey Ray it's sounds like your getting detonation on your engine,If you haven't pulled it out yet check the timing and then try some premium gas or go to this web site and check it out it has good info about gas engines.www. Ticktuners.com

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: shorty on January 11, 2011, 09:53:47 pm

Just wanted to verify the spelling thats Tricktuners lol

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on January 11, 2011, 10:16:28 pm

Well its a little worse than detonation.  One piston is hammered to $hit!  Hopefully this week it gets yanked out.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: kpm on January 12, 2011, 07:05:21 pm

..i'm guessing you have a valve problem..
                                                         kpm

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: bluetoque on January 12, 2011, 07:26:53 pm

Is the exhaust valve pounded to s$it as well?

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on January 13, 2011, 08:41:20 pm

Didn't bother taking the head off since we know the engine has to come out.  Shop is busy right now, still trying to get it in.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: cletus on February 24, 2011, 07:57:58 am

We finally got time to pull our Ford 300 six out to see whats wrong with it.

It looks like something got up into the combustion chamber and hammered up the piston and head. We found a couple of pieces of steel that look like ring material but at this time do not know how the ring could have come up past the top edge of the piston. The good news is that the cylinder walls look good. Since there is only 88 hours on this engine since it had a complete rebuild we will install 1 new piston and a new head. We have often had cooling issued on a long run bucking deep snow and yes we have got it hot a few times.Ted and Bob suggested a thicker rad and a better fan.

Ray & Paul

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311020.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311018.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311012.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311024.jpg

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: the old trucker on February 24, 2011, 10:38:39 am

  How was the plug & the valves ?? Anything chipped off ? I'm curious...           OT.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: the old trucker on February 25, 2011, 04:25:03 pm

    I was talking to my friend today that has helped me with my bomber in the past. I told him about your engine problem. He had snow blower engines that went the same way. He discovered that a screw had let go in the carb & went down through the intake valve.

                                                                                        OT....

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on February 25, 2011, 08:47:04 pm

We couldn't see anything missing from the valves or seats.  Its a real puzzler what got in there, I picked up metal off the face of the piston with a magnet, very similar to a piece of ring.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: the old trucker on February 26, 2011, 03:21:13 am

  My friend said last night when he saw the pics that he thinks it's water.    OT.

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: Swamp Dawg on February 27, 2011, 08:13:47 am

What do you mean water?

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: the old trucker on February 27, 2011, 09:26:47 am

   There is water in the gas pumps at our local gas pumps. A Lot of people with snow blowers have Jerry cans full of gas stored inside their sheds usually in the warm. The water is still mixed with gas & goes directly into the blower tank. If you left the Jerry can outside the water will freeze & sink to the bottom.
   He has taken apart the carb on these engines & seen ice in the bowl. This will cause the engine to buck & spit & it tore up the piston head. I would double check the plug, valve, & the carb for broken or missing parts. If your cylinder wall is OK how could it be a piece of ring ?? I hope your problem isn't too serious as I have the same engine....
 
                                                                            A doubtful ol' trucker
                            

Title: Re: Swamp Dog and Cletus are down
Post by: cletus on March 03, 2011, 08:28:03 pm

 Ford 300 six back in the Bombardier.

We had to take our Ford 300 out to the automotive machine shop to have the cylinder head reworked and the number 1 piston replaced. It has been determined that a foreign piece of metal got into no 1 cylinder and did some damage.
 Since we have had heating issues in the past we had the rad cleaned, purchased a new 6 blade fan from a Ford 300 Industrial power unit and we are now fabricating a fan shroud to optimize air flow from the radiator.
We hope this will help with our operational performance going forward.
Ray
http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311038.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311039-1.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311037.jpg

http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff460/schistbay/Bombardier021311040.jpg